Part 1 can be found here.
UPDATE 1/3/10: December 29th, 2008 I received a phone call from Ron Grossman. The very short version is that he apologized for my experience with the billing from Quest labs and then asked me if I would consider removing this posting. After much consideration, I've decided to leave the posting as is. While I appreciate the apology(even though it's a year and a half late), I stand behind everything I wrote about my experience with Dr. Hart's workshop. As a consumer I like to make informed choices, especially when it comes to laying out hundreds of dollars. I believe that the detailed information of my experience with the workshop will help women make an informed choice about if they want to be involved with other programs Dr. Hart may offer.
As I have stated in the original posting, I believe that Dr. Hart is extremely knowledgeable in her field, very personable, and has the power to help a lot of women. Despite a little disappointment with the workshop itself, my main complaint about my experience was the way in which my billing concerns were handled. Or rather, the way in which I was ignored for months before they got taken care of.
I would encourage Dr. Hart and Mr. Grossman to set a standard for any future business endeavors to provide patients with the same level of common courtesy and respect one might expect to receive from a professional organization. This would include expecting their employees to return phone calls, answer letters or direct them to the appropriate parties, making a timely effort to resolve billing disputes, and proper attention to patient issues from management when it is warranted.
Edit: I just noticed that the program seems to have changed. It's now called 'Hormone House Calls'. Seems to be the same format except your only contact with Dr. Hart will be two ninety minute phone calls. The information suggests that the rest of your care will be handled by 'specially trained hormone nurses'.
This is a long post, but I would highly encourage you to read the whole thing if you are considering attending one of Dr. Hart's workshops or becoming involved with one of her programs.
First things first. Dr. Hart is very knowledgeable about hormones and weight loss. I really and truly believe in The IR Diet, and that bioidentical hormones are far superior to synthetics. This post is not to try to discredit Dr. Hart in any way.
But, I do believe that people should know that my experience with Hormones by Hart has been terribly frustrating, a huge inconvenience, and overall a big waste of my time. Her operation quite nearly damaged my credit, all as a result of complacency on the part of the people in charge of Hormones by Hart (Cheryle Hart is the CEO and Ron Grossman is the COO), along with a general disregard for basic customer service standards, such as returning phone calls. These are things I would have definitely wanted to know before I handed over my hard earned money, because no matter how skilled someone is at what they do, a poorly run operation is frustrating for everyone involved.
In February I attended one of Dr. Hart's free introductory seminars because, as I've talked about at length in my blog, I have experienced hormone problems for quite some time and I was pretty sure I also had a degree of insulin resistance. The seminar lasted an hour or two, during which time Dr. Hart presented information about hormones and insulin resistance, and why bioidenticals are a better choice than synthetics. Dr. Hart is a dynamic speaker, and she keeps you involved with the presentation. It's hard not to like her.
So, this is the deal... At the end of the presentation, she presents the workshop offerings and the costs of the workshop. This is where the time pressure sales tactics begin. At the time I attended the workshop she was offering 3 workshop packages: Three Sisters of Menopause, Hormones of Metabolism, Energy and Stress, and the Combination Package. An enrollment form is handed out before she begins presenting the workshops and it has the following prices on it:
Three Sisters of Menopause: Value = $1031 Price = $895 Day of Seminar Offer = (blank)
Hormones of Metabolism, Energy & Stress: Value = $1419 Price $1195 Day of Seminar Offer = (blank)
Combination Package: Value = $2450 Price $2090 Day of Seminar Offer = (blank)
Then she goes over each of the workshops with you, detailing what is included in each package, and then she presents the 'day of seminar' price. So, by the time the average person has looked at the information they are sticker shocked and are quite glad to think they are getting a 'discount'. The prices when I attended were as follows:
Three Sisters: $545
Metabolism, Energy, and Stress: $745
Combo: $1085
But, that's not all. If those prices are still not affordable for you, she offers a payment plan:
Three Sisters: 2 payments of $297.50 ($595)
M.E.S.: 2 payments of $397.50 ($795)
Combo: 3 payments of $397.50 ($1192.50)
Since I am only in my twenties and still have my uterus and ovaries, I was not eligible to attend the Three Sisters of Menopause workshop, so I had the Metabolism, Energy, and Stress one in my sights. At the time of my first introductory seminar I didn't have an extra $745 laying around, so I went home and came up with a plan. Oh, and in case you are wondering, many health insurance companies don't cover much, if any, of the costs involved with the workshop. Some do, I've heard, but they seem few and far between.
Anyway, the financial details of how I got the money to attend the workshop are not really relevant to what I'm trying to achieve here, but I'll throw them for the sake of the story... I worked overtime at work, about 50 hours over the course of a month and a half, so that I could afford the workshop without affecting our regular budget.
Then, in order to get the 'lower' price for the workshop, I attended another introductory seminar and signed up that night. When you sign up you are given a packet of information, a lab requisition form, and both of Dr. Hart's books (The Feel-Good Diet and The Insulin Resistance Diet). You are supposed to have your labs drawn 2 weeks before your scheduled workshop date, which I did.
About a week before my workshop was scheduled to take place I got a call from Dr. Hart's office. It seems they weren't able to find my lab results. I told the girl on the phone the date I had them done and she asked if I'd had them done with Lab Corp. The question confused me because my lab requisition was for Quest Labs and I was under the impression that was who Dr. Hart's office was using. When I told her this, the girl quickly said "okay, thanks" and hung up.
The day before the workshop I was scheduled to go in for a metabolic activity test. This test measures how many calories per minute you are burning of carbs and fat at which heart rate by collecting data from a mask and heart rate monitor. They also took my weight, body fat percentage, and lean muscle mass using a Tanita scale.
The next day was the workshop. I was surprised when I got there that there were so many ladies in attendance. I was told at both seminars I had attended that class sizes were between 20 and 30 people. There were easily 45 ladies at the workshop that day, and the seats were packed in close together. At each place there was a folder containing several worksheets, a couple packets and several photocopied pages and booklets. Then one of the assitants passed out our lab work.
At this point details are blurry through most of the day. Dr. Hart went over some information and some of the worksheets, then she addressed each of the hormones one by one, explaining how they affect your body and mood, and how to decide which hormones you want to adjust based on your labs and the 'optimal ranges' for those hormones, which she provides.
This part of the workshop was very confusing for me. Not because I had a hard time understanding the effects of the hormones, but because some of the labs I had drawn at Quest contradicted the same labs I had drawn at PAML the very same morning. For example, based on the Quest labs and Dr. Hart's optimal ranges for testosterone, I would benefit from taking testosterone. BUT, because of the PCOS (which was being diagnosed during the time of the workshop), I already have high levels of androgens in my body, wreaking havoc in ways women shouldn't have to experience, and my better judgement told me I didn't want more androgens floating around. (I found out later that between the time I signed up in March and the date of the workshop, Hormones by Hart switched from using Quest Labs to Lab Corp. I got uneasy when I found this out, and as I found out later my fear was valid... )
During the workshop there is some, but relatively little, time available to cover individual questions, especially with the large class we had. This is indicative of the lack of individualized care you can expect from the experience with Dr. Hart. [I was able to talk to her one on one twice. The first time I explained that I was confused about the conflicting lab results, and the second time she looked at my labs personally, and I got about 5 minutes with her (while a huge line formed). This was after the workshop ended.]
Near the end of the workshop, Dr. Hart goes over the costs associated with ongoing consultations and lab tests. Once again, she uses time pressure sales tactics to present this aspect of the program.
The first sheet she hands out details the consultation and lab fees:
Hormone adjustment consultation: $50.
Lab results consultation: $50
6 month evaluation for prescription renewal (required to continue therapy through HbH): $150.
Extended consultation with Dr. Hart: $350/hr (!!!!!)
The sheet goes on to list the lab fees for each test. I won't list them here... if you've had labs covered by insurance before and got the bill in the mail you know many hormone tests are expensive.
BUT, that's not the end of the presentation. After shell shocking you with the out-of-pocket costs for ongoing treatment with Hormones by Hart, Dr. Hart has yet another program to present to you.
This is called the Maven follow-up program, and it's a minimum 6 month commitment. It's multi-tiered and kind of extensive so I've scanned the information in rather than typing it out. Once again, this program time pressure sales tactics associated with it. I only wrote down the silver 'buy today' price because the rest were too expensive for me to consider and to be honest, I was getting disgusted and disillusioned at this point. Click on the picture below to see a larger version.

I actually filled out the order form for the lowest priced program and turned it in. As I was walking out the door I changed my mind and went back and tore up the form. I'm glad I did, because what I've experienced since then has infuriated me.
Before I move on to the most telling part of the story, I want to quickly finish up with my workshop experience.
At the end of the workshop I was able to speak with Dr. Hart for a couple minutes one on one. She looked over my lab results and told me these things, which I already knew from my own research and from talking to my doctor: that my labs were typical for a young woman with PCOS, that I was insulin resistant and would probably benefit from metformin, and that she agreed with my opinion that I should not take testosterone.
That was it. All stuff I already knew.
So, walking out of the workshop I was definitely disappointed. By the time I left the workshop that day, I was ready to be done with the idea I'd had in my mind that the workshop with Dr. Hart would be the key to my recovery and that by following her advice I would rid myself of hormonal troubles and excess weight.
I think a lot of women who attend the workshops are disillusioned this way. A lot, but not all. The majority of us have had trouble getting our own doctors to listen to our hormone woes and we are thankful that here, finally, is a doctor that understands and has the answer! I felt this way and I saw on a lot of women's faces that same feeling of relief. The truth is that Dr. Hart has helped a lot of women feel better, and I think that is great. Honestly. But I also think that a lot of women leave the workshop feeling like I did. Especially those of us for whom the costs of ongoing treatment are not practical. There is a lot of information in the workshop that is valuable, but a large part of it also feels like the hard sell.
However, I want to make it clear that by the time the workshop was over and I was feeling a little let down, I also felt a sense of relief. Walking out, I was ready to leave my hopefulness about Dr. Hart's program behind and do the hard work on my own. Leaving the workshop that day, I was disappointed in my personal experience, but not regretful or sorry I had paid for and experienced it.
It's important that I make that clear, because it would be easy to assume that because I was disappointed in my experience with Dr. Hart's program that I want to defame her. But, as you will see, from here on my problems with Hormones by Hart have nothing to do with my experience at the workshop.
(By the way, one last note about the program.... it is definitely set up more for older ladies than for young women. If you are a young woman suspecting hormonal problems you may well benefit from some aspects of the workshop, but not so much as peri, post, or menopausal women.)
I think my complaint with Hormones by Hart would best be summed up by posting the complaint I filed with the Better Business Bureau. There are more details than are listed in my complaint because the BBB has a set character limit, but the basics are here:

Basically, my disgust for my experience with Hormones by Hart lies in the general state of disorganization that the company seems to be in. This is evidenced in not only my experience with the Quest billing situation, but also in several mailings I've received from the office since the workshop. They have sent me prescriptions for metformin and a glucose monitor/strips/lancets, with no explanation as to why I was getting the prescription, especially since I'd already told Dr. Hart that my doctor was taking care of those things for me. I have received invoices that appeared to be bills at first glance (which nearly gave me a heart attack), but were actually supposed to be reimbursement forms. Things just thrown in an envelope with no letter accompanying them to explain what the intention was.
I also participated in a conference call program with The Insulin Resistance Diet (before the workshop) where we were told when we signed up that certain things would be included, only to find out later that they were not. I've heard people involved with different programs offered by Dr. Hart complain about having a difficult time getting ahold of anyone at the organization when they had questions about a product or difficulties with their order. There is also this complaint from last April about another product Dr. Hart markets... something called a Thigh Design System. I saw this after I'd already signed up for the workshop and wished I could get my money back because it just gave me a bad feeling about things in general.
Here's the deal. I can handle disorganization and I find inefficiency to be irritating, but I am willing to put up with these things if I am truly benefitting from what someone is offering. In this case, the inconvenience was so great that I regret much of the total experience. If I could do it over again, I would not give my money to this company.
One thing I absolutely refuse to deal with, and the thing that makes me madder than hell is when a company refuses to show any concern for me as a customer/patient, especially when they can remedy the situation by taking responsibility for their mistake.
It is absolutely negligent to allow a customer/patients credit to be threatened (I had 30 days left before Quest was going to report me to the credit bureau) because of a dispute that has nothing to do with the patient. Especially when they could have easily remedied the situation by transferring the balance to their Quest account, thus taking me completely out of the equation.
On 9/23 I got this email from the accounting supervisor
your bill has been paid. I have been laid off since the first of August so
there has been nothing done with it. Our COO would not let me pay for it before
because of the billing errors on it. It has been paid anyway with check #
xxxx.
So, basically, Ron Grossman (the COO) refused to pay the bill even though he
damn well knew (because I sent the CEO a certified letter about the
situation) that my credit was being threatened as a result of their negligence. Additionally, in the correspondence I received through the BBB, he claims that the accounting supervisor had 'been on vacation', where she clearly told me she had been laid off.
Quest told me that all they would've had to do was transfer the balance on my account over to theirs while they tried to resolve the billing dispute. This could've easily been done with a phone call, saving me $20 worth of certified letters and a whole lot of aggravation and stress.
As of now (actually about a week ago) my claim with the BBB has been 'resolved' and I'm now carrying a zero balance with Quest.
And through all of this, Hormones by Hart never initiated any communication with me regarding the issue. All inquiries were from me to them, and many of those went unanswered.
As a result of my experience, I would never recommend this business, or anything affiliated with them to another person. Other business entities registered by Cheryle Hart and Ron Grossman are: Wellness Workshop, Hormone Harmony, Crania Company (manufacturers of CraniYums), Bodywell Design (that's for the thigh deal I believe), and Women's Workshop Health Salon & Spa. There may be others, but those are the ones registered with the BBB. ]
Ultimately, if you've stumbled across this post searching for information, the decision is up to you. But I believe there are other resources available to most women, and for a much more reasonable price than you will be charged by Hormones by Hart. Start by checking with your local compounding pharmacist to see who prescribes bioidentical hormones in your area. Also, Susanne Somers has some books available with great information about bioidenticals.
I will gladly answer anyone's questions about my experience... please email me at smashingdawna a t hotmail do t com!